Jasper, an unflappable scoundrel, 2 Redrain Guards arrive, following Deva.

Nothing particularly fancy stands out in the Shrine of Limerance, short of its own innate charms, except for the leggy woman in a bear fur cloak leaning against a wall in the corner. She's waiting, clearly, but not in any hurry.

Nothing particularly fancy stands out in the Shrine of Limerance, short of its own innate charms, except for the leggy woman in a bear fur cloak leaning against a wall in the corner. She's waiting, clearly, but not in any hurry. Giada's attention drifts across the shrine, occasionally glancing towards the entrance if the door moves.


Felix has arrived somewhat right on time; if not just a touch early. Wandering in and taking a seat quietly, with Ralph at his heels, kept from wandering off by a touch of the hand and an apple that gets smashed into the ground, the goat settles down to eat it. A lifted hand and smile for Giada, making no move to interrupt his fellow Godsworn in their own preparations.

Sermon time. Deva appears pensive as she strides in, hands stuffed into her cloak pockets. There are quick, polite smiles as she searches for an empty seat.

Padding into the shrine quietly, Dycard leans slightly to the side in muted conversation with his bosun. For once the man isn't waved off, and instead occupies a seat at the back of the gathering while Dycard goes to drop himself into a seat near the front. Crossing his right leg over his left, he casts his bright cerulean eyes about while smiling widely, brushing a lock of hair from his face.

Griz the huge wolfhound, Muninn the cocky raven arrive, following Aelgar.

Giada's preparations seem to be a trio of obliging braziers warming an angled group of settees and benches. In this unassuming corner, however, the glory of the shrine is on full display. "Thanks for coming," says Giada, waving people closer. "Have a seat, there's some mulled wine in that thing there..." She points to a tiny table holding a large kettle-like container.

Aelgar has joined the Bride's Pews.

Aelgar has left the Bride's Pews.

Aelgar has joined the Visitors' Pews.

Aelgar enters quietly and parks himself quietly at an open seat to focus on Sister Giada.

Giada has joined the To the Side of the Shrine.

Aelgar sits quietly, meditating or praying or something, his posture erect and his hands folded neatly in his lap as he waits to hear the wisdom rain down upon him.

Nodding agreeably toward Giada, Dycard uncrossed his leg and leaned forward slightly, his elbows resting atop his knees as he clasped his hands together just before them. He offered a nod in a flash of familiarity toward Deva as she entered, before his attention swept toward the pitcher of wine for just a moment and then coming back to rest on the sermonizer.

Deva first waves in friendly fashion at Felix and Ralph as she finds a bench to drop onto. As she looks over a shoulder and catches Dycard's greeting, he gets a wave too. There's a slight tense air around her in the way she carries herself, and her posture is remarkably proper for one who usually slouches. Her attention settles on Giada with an attentive expression, like she's Totally Ready for this.


Waiting with a quiet calm of patience, Felix has chosen his seat a bit away from the rest, likely due to the scent of the forge that he brings with him. A smile and a wave from Felix is returned to Deva, and Ralph gives her a typical baleful gaze from in between bites of smashed apple.

Giada just motions people closer again, giving Arlgar's prim princess posture an amused look before turning back as everyone gets settled. "Right, so if any of you attended my 'sermon' on Lagoma, this will seem rather familiar. For anyone new, I'll chat a bit, and then we'll all chat." She leans back against the wall where she sits, and a hand gestures expansively. "Limerance. God of love and fidelity. Look at how beautifully we honour him, how close he is to the fabric of who we are as a society. How Limerance undpins us, gives us all his gifts, and guides us. Now..." Her eyes turn back to the other four. "Let's get a bit creative."

"What is a world -without- Limerance?"

"What," Giada repeats again, "is a world without Limerance?" She looks from face to face, her own expression relaxed and curious. "As in, he never existed in our knowing. Let's start with a practical application of the question: finances. How would the god of Oaths' absense be felt?" At this point, she motions for the others to answer as they will.

His head listing to the side in amusement, Dycard furrowed his brow as he considered the question. Glancing over his shoulder and shrugging, Dycard lifted a hand slightly and chuckled as he raised his voice to speak. "Do you mean to say if there just...wasn't a god with that, ah...portfolio? Well - I like to imagine one man is as good as the next, all things considered. There's nothing to stop me from making a deal and sticking to it if my personal convictions make it a priority for me, is there?"

Aelgar narrows his eyes at Giada a moment, reading her expressions rather accurately, but then he is distracted by her question. Thoughtful only a moment, he then grins at some thought and offers, "Hellow, everyone. I am Brother Aelgar, for anyone not yet familiar. I am imagining a world where all monetary deals are accompanied by mercenary enforcers as a matter of course..." A broad grin as he seems to envision some amusing scenes internally.

Giada "Assuming that you have the choice granted you, I should imagine so," Giada answers Dycard, "but the question is what would a world without those -precepts- be?"

Giada says, "How would the loss of Limerance and his precepts change our world?"


Felix is quiet for a time, letting others offer their own answers before he offers a reply. "While not joyless, I imagine there would be a lack of .. sustenance. While we may not say that we 'love' an individual, because we do not ourselves think of it that way - there is still a 'love' between members of family, sometimes in marriages, and with those comrades that we have spent more than a little time with. Fought and bled with." he muses. "And a lack of trust, especially between strangers, when oaths are exchanged. How would one House trust another to support or defend them, if such oaths bore no significance?"

"It would probably be pretty chaotic," Deva ventures warily, with a hesitant glance around the room. This is not her comfort zone. "If we can't rely on other people or trust in them, it becomes every person for themselves. That gets pretty lonely." It almost sounds like she's speaking from experience.

"Without Limerance, are we without trust, trustworthiness or honor?" Aelgar wonders in an almost privately low voice.

Shrugging and sitting back up in his seat, Dycard's sharklike grin flashed. "Even without honor or obligation, as inconceivable as that is, surely basic survival instinct would force at least some level of cooperation wouldn't it? If nothing else, than as a product of convenience. Like animals."


"I don't think we'd have a Compact as we do now." Felix offers, as a followup. "As it was a coming together of tribes, forming Houses, that swore oaths to each other to form what we now have, over time. And we continue to expand with those tribes that come to join in said Compact. Because it is a chain of oaths, is it not, with marriages that followed - built upon more oaths, that keep it all tied together?" With a glance around the shrine.

Giada nods slowly as she listens to the others, her green eyes focusing from one person to the next as they speak. "So we've mentioned chaos, interpersonal relations, a need for enforced scruitiny, and isolation. The mention of isolation is spot on." The woman pushes her hood the rest of the way back and readjusts its fit before continuing, a hand motioning any possible new arrivals to venture closer. "With a lack of socially established trust in rules and values, we are as individuals... individuals. There is no social cohesion beyond a primal enemy-of-my-enemy alliance. After all, once the threat is gone, those former allies might have some -really- pretty star iron jewelry that would look just fantastic around your finger."

The priestess looks to Felix and nods agreeably. "Society is formed by mutual trust and adherence to common values and aims. If there is no trust, then there are no allies, and we are all of us alone."


Aelgar nods to Dycard and Deva. "We do seem to gather by instinct. People live and work together, mostly." Felix gets a grin as well. "And we use Limerance to help us gather when maybe we are not so aligned in thought or belief, so that would be a harder task." To Giada, the Scholar wonders, "Might we not base some value on reputation or demonstrated commitment? Like, Aelgar always keeps his promises in the past, so he is probably going to keep this one?"

"Risk assessment is a normal act for the mind and soul, yes, Brother Aelgar," Giada agrees while nodding at Dycard. "When we align against an enemy as our own basis of trust... It's an optimistically calculated risk. With no fidelity in the world, what if they switch sides in the middle of the battle? What else would be different without Lord Limerance?"

"Risk assessment is a normal act for the mind and soul, yes, Brother Aelgar," Giada agrees while nodding at Dycard. "When we align against an enemy as our only basis of trust... It's an optimistically calculated risk. With no fidelity in the world, what if they switch sides in the middle of the battle? What else would be different without Lord Limerance?" <fixed>

Deva is listening attentively, glancing around at answers and faces, but as time goes by she sinks more and more into the bench with visible discomfort. She has no comment for now, just a long, silent stare at a point on the wall.

Giada is possibly evil. Maybe. She looks at the poor beleathered Deva and arches an eyebrow. "I wonder, Highness, if you could share your perspective from the North. I understand that the Spirits also place stock in oaths, maybe you could give us another angle to consider? Sorry."

"I think we have a sense of nation now." Aelgar supposes after a moment, still seated attentively with the natural ease of the dedicated meditation practitioner. "We have disagreements, but if the fundamental cohesion is bound by oath, they are simply passing winds. Without the oathing, there would be more escalation and therefore a lack of that sense that we are bound together to a common goal. The whole concept of the larger group would need to be built differently.

"I think we have a sense of nation now." Aelgar supposes after a moment, still seated attentively with the natural ease of the dedicated meditation practitioner. "We have disagreements, but if the fundamental cohesion is bound by oath, they are simply passing winds. Without the oathing, there would be more escalation and therefore a lack of that sense that we are bound together to a common goal. The whole concept of the larger group would need to be built differently." (re)

Given the empty seats beside him, Dycard leans back slightly and drapes his arms over the back of the chairs beside him as he tosses his head back to scrutinize Deva as she was called on. He turned back toward Giada and picked up slightly, "Are we assuming then, that these ideas of honor and love and all of Limerance's domain could exist without his existence? Since we're willing to indulge Shamanism what stops us from taking oaths then, or entering the bondage of marriage?"

"Um, well, I--" Deva's wide-eyed and exhales. "I'm pretty much as pantheon following as anyone else here," she murmurs, looking around over her shoulders as if to check. "My mom would be a way better person to ask that question if you're wanting stuff about the Spirits." She looks pretty nervous and agitated with the attention, not as much the question. Still, her palms slide over her knees and rub back and forth. Is it really hot in here? "Oaths are important to us too," she croaks. "We're so-- we're pretty independent up there? But we still need each other."


Felix, perhaps surprisingly, does offer up something, when Giada addresses Deva. "It would depend on which path of shamanistic worshop you're asking after. The Path of Gales, for example, from the northeastern areas around Stormheart Vale - focuses more primarily on the individual and their own spiritual needs, sometimes with help from a shaman in the forming of bonds with the spirits. Less so of direct oaths. There is a belief, quite fervently, that everything a part of the world shares a connection to each other. And it is the individual's responsibility to find their place within it. Their own personal truth, as it were."

Deva stares at Felix and nods like 'yeah, this guy knows way more than I do' as she tries to melt into the floor.

Giada listens quietly to those gathered, though Dycard earns himself a quick, raffish smile. "Honour is also shared by Gloria. Consider Limerance more the god of fidelity to commitment. Honour is a category in and of itself, even if there's an obvious link between that and what we consider to be 'honourable'. As for indulging the thoughts of shamanism, maybe I'm just a Mirrormask and asking confusing questions. I tend to think that the Faithful can learn what they believe when observing the faith of others."

Felix providing the answer has her listening just as attentively. "Individual threads in the tapestry, perhaps," she muses. "But! Back to Limerance. So now we've considered the loss of honoured oaths, of love, of Limerance himself, and we see how we would be completely different, in a different world. Compared with the lack, what questions do you find yourself wondering of the presence? What gratitude? What confusion? Whatever crosses you mind, anything that comes up when you consider the lack. And... how can you implement the answer into your daily life?"

Aelgar falls silent, appearing introspective as he regards the group. Finally, he ventures slowly, "Well, I am a little thankful I live in the real world and not the imaginary one..."

Deva eventually gets up to get herself a glass of wine. From then on, she's remarkably silent, because she has some drinking to do while she watches Giada with all the serious attention she can muster.

Aelgar glances at the door, perhaps checking the time as he has fallen silent now, listening more than contributing.

Dycard bows his head slightly, allowing wild locks of hair to fall down and obscure his face while he strokes his beard with one hand. He remains silent for a beat as if in consideration of what he's thankful for as he clasps his hands together once more between his knees.

Giada waits a while for people to have their moments of reflection. Then, she inhales and stands. "Take that consideration with you. Examine it and see how you can work it into your life, to give honour to Lord Limerance."